Life Lessons with Jimmy Catalano
Accomplished National Rowing Teammate, Jimmy Catalano, opens up about his journey, accomplishments, and struggles as a coxswain. His wisdom and advice goes beyond rowing and really touches on all aspects of life. Get inspired and feel seen by listening and sharing this episode.
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This Transcript is Autogenerated:
Jimmy Catalano 0:02
I've raced all over the world. I've been on the u 23. National Team. I'm a four year varsity letter winner Wisconsin, I said, in the sport of rowing, and guess what? I have never taken a competitive stroke in my entire life, you know, make yourself and disposable.
Kristi Wagner 0:15
Welcome to the other three years a show for anyone who has an Olympic sized dream they want to turn into a reality. Hi, and welcome to this week's episode of the other three years. This is super fun episode I had my national team teammate and men's a Coxon for the past few years Jimmy Catalino on to talk about his life and coxing and so many things. So Jimmy is a super accomplished Coxon and athlete he is an alum of both Greenwich crew and the University of Wisconsin men's rowing team. He's a three time national team member he was on the 2021 u 23. Team and has been the Coxon for the senior national team men's eight the past few summers. He also cost the course record in the men's champion at the 2022, head of the Charles, which I didn't ask him about. And I'm really regretting because that would have been awesome as we're almost at this year's head of the Charles so we might have to have him on for part two. But it was a super fun conversation with Jimmy had so much to share and his wisdom really went beyond just rowing and coxing like all of his advice was just life advice. And it's crazy how much of what makes you good at a sport is really just what makes you good at life. And what makes you a good teammate is just what makes you a good person like it. It really hit home with me the way that Jimmy would talk about certain things was just how to be a good person how to find success in the world, how to overcome setbacks, and it was all true for coxing and rowing. But it was just also really true for life. But Jimmy shared what a Coxon his job really entails and how you balance the tricky task of being Park coach and part athlete as a Coxon. We just talked about his journey, how he got to where he is and what lies ahead. Jimmy is now an assistant coach at Northeastern University. So we talked about the balance between coaching and his own athletic career and a lot more. So it was a super fun conversation. And I hope everyone really enjoys it. But before we get into that, here is an update on what's going on with my training right now. So I'm a little bit late in doing this week's update. So it's actually Wednesday of the week. This comes out in just a couple of days. But it's been a good week. So far. This past weekend, I went and raced at this kind of interesting duel style race in tuxedo Park, New York, which is just outside the city, and it was called the 1886 Regatta. And it was really cool. It was a invitation eight scholars, eight men and eight women and it was duel style. So up to three rounds of racing. The race was 1886 meters long. Yeah, it was it was fun. I had, you know, some good racing, some fine racing, my teammate Savannah one, which I know that that was probably a really big one for her and well earned and I'm really happy for her. And it was really fun to see, you know, a lot of my friends and teammates and get a lot of people back together. And the people that put the race on that live in tuxedo Park were so nice. And it's so nice of them and amazing of them to be supporting American rowers at this level. And it was really cool. So it was fun. It was like a celebration of rowing. And there were a lot of cocktail parties and that kind of thing. So it kind of jump started the week because it was on we did a full Saturday practice went down there had a cocktail party did the racing on Sunday at another cocktail party you drove home got back at like 1130 and then just jumped into the week of training on Monday morning. So definitely a bit of a of a jumpstart to the week. But Monday was a little bit rough. I'm happy to be through that and have gotten a few more good night's of sleep, to feel feel good back in normal training. Now this week has been good. And just kind of trying to get some base training in doing some longer pieces. Definitely feeling like you know, fitness is coming back. This is officially the first week of training back from the World Championships for the US National Team. This is the first week that we received like a workout schedule on that kind of stuff. So it definitely feels good to like be back be on the road to the things we want to accomplish this year. And there's a lot of work to do. But I think when you take it in bite sized chunks, it's It's more manageable and honestly more fun. So yeah, this weekend is just kind of a chill weekend and then next weekend, we've got the big head of the Charles. So it's all it's all fun stuff. It's definitely fall, the weather has certainly changed. We are wearing more clothes to practice. I like fall, though. So I'm okay with it. And honestly, we had a very long summer this year. I was in Florida, and then California and Italy and then Princeton and then Italy. I feel like it was 85 degrees for like, seven months. So a little bit of chilly weather actually feels kind of nice. If I'm being honest. Yeah. So that's basically what's been going on but things are good. I got a tall Stuart's coffee right here to fuel me through the rest of my day. And yeah, Feeling good. Feeling good. So now it's time for my conversation with Jimmy catalogo. No, and I hope you guys all enjoy it so much. Yeah, let me know what you think. Hi, Jimmy, I'm so excited to have you on the podcast this week. Hello, how are you? I'm good. This week. I have Jimmy Catalino Are you from Greenwich, like did you grow up in Greenwich also,
Jimmy Catalano 6:16
I was born and raised in Greenwich
Kristi Wagner 6:19
from Greenwich, Connecticut, and then rode at Wisconsin, and he's now coaching at Northeastern and also has been the Coxon for the men's aid for the past two years. YEAH. Jimmy, I thought we could just start with high school or like what whenever you got because Greenwich has Middle School rowing, right. So when did when you got into kind of how you got into it?
Jimmy Catalano 6:43
Yeah. So I ended up in rowing, I used to play a bunch of different sports, but I played soccer primarily for pretty much my whole life. And I tried out for the Greenwich high school soccer team 100 kids tried out for a 20 spot roster, and I fully got cut. And I was pretty devastated. You know, in my world, my life was over. But so yeah, so I, you know, didn't really know what to do. I knew I still wanted to play sports. And my mom basically urged me one of her friends and her had been doing like a learn to row. None of no one in my family had rode. I don't even know what it was. But basically she urged me to go try out for the team because at the time, Greenwich crew had been doing their tryout process after their Greenwich high school sports were done because they knew that there were going to be kids that got cut. It's funny now the sport has gotten so popular, it's actually reverse. So it's kind of interesting. So I walked down there I didn't really want to go actually tried rugby for like a day because my brother played rugby, I hated it. Walked down there and basically yeah, I started rowing and then pretty much leading up to the first race which was the head of that we just tonic we're going to that race. No one had like chosen to be a Coxon yet because they were just cycling everyone through. And my coach basically asked me, he said, you know, you know, you're kind of a smaller guy. We think you'd be good at this boxing thing. You know, could you try it for this first race? If you hit it, you never have to do it again. And that was you know, almost 10 years ago now. So kind of the, you know, kind of trajectory was past that point.
Kristi Wagner 8:15
So did you grow, like also that season? Or did you then just stick with coxing?
Jimmy Catalano 8:21
No, I did. I have never raced a competitive race in my life, which I always find very funny. I did that first race as a Coxon and that was it. I've rode and you know, I've taken out small boats before. And I've been in AIDS before but I have, I always have this joke. You know, when I was graduating from Wisconsin, they had the seniors always got to say stuff, you know, when they graduated. And one of the things that I had said was kind of this idea of, you know, making yourself and disposable in life, no matter what you do. It's a powerful tool. And I said, I've raced all over the world. I've been on the u 23. National Team. I'm a four year varsity letter winner, Wisconsin, I'm wanting to be on the senior team at the time. I wasn't on I said, in the sport of rowing. And guess what, I have never taken a competitive stroke in my entire life. You know, make yourself indispensable. You know, I always just think it's kind of funny, you know, obviously, it's it's a little bit arrogant, but I think it's kind of funny.
Kristi Wagner 9:14
So we do have some listeners of the podcast who don't row so do you think you could just give I think I've explained coxing before but obviously because I normally row in non Cox boats. Do you think you can just give like a layman's tour? Kind of what what your role is? Because it's really cool. I think people like Yeah, think that you guys just kind of Scream. But that's not it.
Jimmy Catalano 9:41
I think for someone you know, who doesn't know anything about wrestling or maybe has like a soft knowledge of it. I always say that a Coxon is a position on the team. That is a very in between place it's very in between a rower and a coach. You still have you know, kind of the role of being an athlete You're still with your, you know, rowers and you're in the boat and you're racing obviously. But then you kind of have this, you know, tread this line of also having the knowledge and the kind of taking what the coach says and reiterating it to the team. And then kind of the end of the day, your voice is the only voice that's heard during a race, right? So you really tread that line very finely between the two roles. And you know, sometimes you're too far one way, and sometimes you're too far. The other, it's kind of kind of the name of the game, which is quite fun. I always compare it to like a horse jockey in racing or, you know, an f1 driver, you know, it's kind of the same premise of, there's a bit of this kind of different role or different aspect of having kind of power around you, or power kind of moving you from point A to point B. And you're kind of, I always like to say coxing is a very, the way to really boil it down is it's just very high level decision making. You're making decisions about steering, you're making decisions about race plans, you're making decisions about what you're feeling in the boat, and you know, how you'd like to fix something or how you want to get more of an athlete, you know, you're kind of juggling all those roles at the same time. So I think, I think that's the best way to describe it, you know, to someone who has no idea what it is, there's many, many different facets of what it does. At the end of the day, one of you know, even at the senior national team and I this I learned this, you know, right before I went to that first trip that has Teutonic who's atonic, your number one role is safety. Right? So that's in that that's from you know, now this Coxon in middle school to you know, the senior national team Coxon, because you know, you've got eight people on your boat who are not looking the direction the boat is going. So yeah, like safety is a huge part of it. Athlete, kind of energy and athlete direction of power and athlete, you know, kind of centric relationships comes a lot from coxing as well. And so, you know, it's, I know, it's a little bit of a long winded answer. But as you know, it's there's a lot of things to it, right? It's not just one thing that I do, or any toxin does,
Kristi Wagner 11:54
no, it's definitely like a pretty all encompassing role. I feel like you talked about one thing that I personally feel must be really challenging. And I also feel like is pretty pertinent into just like, life in general. And so I'm wondering if you have any kind of moments that like stand out from you mentioned, kind of toeing the line between being like an athlete and a coach, and you don't have to be super specific, but I'm wondering if there's any moments where you kind of really, were experiencing that, and maybe you crossed the line and had to come back? And how you sort of have learned over the years, maybe how to balance those two things in a more productive and effective way?
Jimmy Catalano 12:40
Yeah, it's definitely tough. I had points in my, you know, rowing career that I have gone, you know, one way or the other a little too far. And I think it's about, I think maturity and being very in tune to the different moving parts to the situation, right. So you know, when you're in Bo, you're an athlete, you're racing, you know, what's happening, I think that there are definitely times especially when you're younger, there are definitely times where maybe athletes are kind of maybe they're off direction, or they're, you know, they're they're, they've lost sight of what we're doing, or maybe you have to say something that isn't, you know, the most popular opinion, right, like, you make a decision to redo a drill, right? Because we didn't do it correctly. And you know, like 1617 year old kids will be, you know, kind of, why do we have to do that again, so, you know, but but then I think, you know, you shouldn't distance yourself so much because there's so much power and so much strength and speed to be found in that connection of trust, right? So your athletes, they want to get in the boat, and they want to know you're going to do everything in your power to make the boat go fast, right? So if you're just completely separating yourself from the crew and and just being a coach, you lose that trust and you lose that sense of you know, you know, relationship that kind of, you know, happens between a Coxon and a crew. And then on the other side, you've got that that you know that coaches relationship, right, you sit and spend a lot of time speaking with a coach as a Coxon, you know, way more than the athletes do, whether it's you're sitting on the launch, or you're just chatting after practice, before practice, all that kind of stuff. And you have to remember that they're not in the boat, right? And you have to remember that they want the best, you know, you hope that they want the best for the boat. And so you can't distance yourself too far from them, either because they're going to help you get maintain, or they're going to help you, you know, achieve the success that you're looking for. And so I think that is a good question. And I think it's something that you navigate, I still navigate to this day, right? And I think, you know, once you kind of, you know, you'll be on a you'll be on a high school team and then you're on a college team and there's, you know, more athletes, more coaches, you know, another team there may be another another team there. Then you go on to the senior national review a u 23. Team. You've got three weeks to do that with a new coach and you know, 10 new athletes, and then you go to the senior national team and you throw in different Boat Club as is and, you know, it's it's something that I still work on all the time. And it's not just like I've figured it out. And that's how you're gonna do. I think that's a really, really good thing to highlight because it's something that really isn't talked about that often. And so I think it's just something you keep working towards as you continue to navigate your career, if you will.
Kristi Wagner 15:19
I think it's similar questions, I think similar. And also, like you touched on transitioning from high school to college. Like, I think one thing that rowing is pretty cool about or like, I've always thought it was cool. Like, it's very, you know, black and white in a lot of ways, like, you know, for rowers to get recruited to college. There's numbers and race results. And obviously, there is some sort of abstract stuff. But for Calkins, like, I mean, of course, you have race results, but how do you like go about the whole process of, of stepping up, be it like, from A to B to A one V, or from high school to college or on the 23? Team? Like how do you make yourself stand out? And yeah, be memorable? Yeah. Has it changed?
Jimmy Catalano 16:11
I don't know. I think that is, that is definitely like the million dollar question. I get asked that a lot. And I say, you know, I think at the end of the day, it's a lot of hard work, right. And I always tell people that from the outside looking in, I think that sometimes things that have brushed comments that have somewhat frustrated me, sometimes it's just like, oh, well, you just got handed that or you just you fell into this. And it's like, no, it took a lot of work. And it took a lot of rejection, a lot of failures and a lot of figuring out the wrong way to do it. Right. I always like that. It's like, you've figured out the wrong way to do something. And you're smarter now, you know. And I think overall, you know, how do you make those steps? I always say like, you have no, like you said, there's no number, right? There's no out of 10 or a scoring out of 100 or a letter grade that goes to a Coxon, right? So it's super subjective. And I think that how do you I always like to think of coxing in all like, especially when you're on a college team, or high school team kind of as like, a little bit of a stock chart, right. And so you've got all these toxins, or maybe you've only got a few or you got a bunch, but you know, you've got a stock chart, right. And so you kind of have, you can have these ups and downs throughout the season. And I think it's, it's the idea that, like, you're on a path, you know, trajectory up, right. So like, maybe you're showcasing throughout the entire season that like you're reliable, you're safe, you are trying to get better, and you are trying to, you know, expand your knowledge about rolling, you're trying to connect with the team, it's, it's many different kinds of little things that you can work toward that showcase to the team, to your coach to yourself, to the athletes, that you're the right person for the job, that's kind of what it comes down to. It's not really like, oh, you know, Jimmy's really good at steering? And we're gonna It's are you the right person for that crew at that right time? I always kind of think about that, in that sense. And how do you do that there's, there's many different ways you can kind of showcase that. But I always like to say, one thing that you know, is super kind of gritty about coxing is, is, you're going to make mistakes, constantly, I make mistakes every single day. And if you're gonna say you don't, then you're lying. Because like I said, You're a high level decision maker. And so and everyone makes mistakes every day, but you are making very profound, very, you know, highlighted decisions during the day, and sometimes they're gonna be wrong. And it's very easy to highlight when those are wrong, because it's, that's when you're the only one talking, you're the only one steering, you're the only one, whatever. And so I always say that it's okay to make mistakes. It is it is 100% A part of the job. Sometimes it sucks. Sometimes it sucks when you made a bad decision and your coach is getting into you and the guy that then you know, your athletes are getting frustrated. It's not easy. It's not fun part of the job. But what I will say and one really keen thing that I think you know Coxon can utilize to showcase that they're getting better, is acknowledging that they made a mistake, learning from it, and showcasing to a team or a boat or a coach, how you're not gonna do that again. And that's such an such a profound way to showcase how you're getting better. And it's like you PR by five seconds on our drug tests. It's super easy to showcase, oh, I'm bad. I'm faster. I'm better. I did better on my 2k on the water. But there is no number like I said, and so owning up to it, learning from it and not doing it again, because doing it twice comes off, as you know, you're not learning, it's coming off as you don't care. Well, maybe that's not true. But that's just perception is reality. And that could be what someone perceives you as. So that's always where I start with toxins on a grand scale, like scheme of things in terms of like, how do you get from A to B to the one V or how do you make the national team or how do you that's a really good place to start because it can encompass a lot of different aspects of the sport on land on water all around. It's it's, it's a really good way to think about things.
Kristi Wagner 19:53
Yeah. I mean, I feel like that's just good advice. I mean, it is like, but I do think that One thing that you said is so true. I mean, and we're all guilty of it. But like, everyone thinks that other people's paths were easy. It's so easy to see people like online or on social media or just like hear about people. And you're like, oh, they just got that, because of whatever. But everyone had to work hard. Like, I don't know, I feel like that was the thing that I like learned most about being on the senior team was like, Oh, nobody made it right away. It wasn't easy for anybody.
Jimmy Catalano 20:31
No, gosh, no, not at all.
Kristi Wagner 20:33
And so as soon as you kind of stopped thinking that you're like, oh, okay, I do have to work hard I do, I will fail forward or whatever. What are like some of the biggest kind of like mistakes, you think that you see toxins making? Either just like in their coxing or in trying to get noticed or? Yeah,
Jimmy Catalano 20:57
yeah, I think, you know, first is definitely the like, mistake thing and not owning up to it. I think that's, that's pretty, especially for someone younger, I think it's really hard to own up to that. I think that another thing that I always talk to Caucasians about is, especially when I'm working with toxins, who are younger, or not even, it's all different types of toxins, but I always say that I should be able to like, listen to your recording, right, and it shouldn't just be in the middle of a 2k, I should be able to like pop into your practice, you know, sit in your boat, you know, in the 25th minute of your steady state piece on a Tuesday, whatever. And I should be able to sit there and listen to you coxing from your voice. And I think that that's really important because the role itself is very much so trial and error and learning on the go. There isn't really a good way like you can't sit there and do arms and body over pausing drill to try to get the hands around the back end pause. That's something you can do constantly, constantly constantly. You can grow on the square for a while they can run the feather like there are very specific drills that you can do that help with different parts of the stroke. There really isn't stuff like that on a grand scale things that you do every day as a Coxon. So yes, you are going to go listen to recordings online or you are going to listen to your coach or you're going to listen to the varsity Coxon when you're you know the three V Coxon or whatever it is, and you're going to learn from you know your surroundings and the situation all that kind of stuff that is completely 100% A part of the role. What I will say though, is I don't like when I listen to a Coxon and I and I can hear immediately, they're trying to imitate, or they're trying to be something that they're not right. And there's so many different ways to be a Coxon. And I don't like this narrative that like you have to be this or you have to be super calm or you like you just have to be you in the boat, and produce the best possible outcome that you can. And the best way you can do that is coxing from your own voice. And like I can listen to recordings and I can know right away, because you can listen to people in conversations and know right away if they're actually talking from their own voice. And if they're really passionate about what they're saying. And if they're speaking freely. And they're not hindered by thinking am I going to say the right thing and all that kind of stuff. And so I find that that is a big misconception about when people are coxing is that you have to put on this role. And you have to I think you have to have certain qualities that sometimes maybe you need to kind of dial up a little bit like competence and kind of just calmness. That's that's all things that are great. But like, I should listen to Jimmy's Coxen recording and it's like, I should be able to have a conversation with him later in the day and say, Oh, that's, you know, it's the same person. I think that because trying to do something, pretending to be something that you're not it's extremely difficult. And I think that is a huge misconception and that I mean, that's also true for life. I think a lot of these are narratives that continue on past caucusing, but it's just something that I always start with, especially with younger cousins. When they asked me for advice. Like it's, it's really easy to do that. I think the other thing that I like we talked about earlier in the conversation is just like making sure you tread that line, you know, the between the coach and the Coxon. Like it's kind of like a fish line where you're like you're kind of going through it like a fish and you're going back and forth because you go too far. One way you lose the trust the coach, you go too far the other way you lose trust with the athletes, so you just kind of have to sit there and and you know, be you and you know, trust your gut. And that's kind of you know, those are the mistakes that I I generally see in the beginning.
Kristi Wagner 24:25
All coxing advice is apparently life advice. So in your own like, career, athletic career, how kind of far ahead were you thinking in high school? Were you just I'm enjoying my time as part of this team. And then it'd be cool to Coxen college and then kind of transitioning to the senior team. Like how did that all happen? Because I know you would like just graduated when you started coxing the senior team last year and it's obviously a bit of a different Do you want to get into like coaching, but maybe not answering? Answering like that first?
Jimmy Catalano 25:06
I definitely struggle from impostor syndrome quite quite frequently. And so I kept kind of finding myself in situations where I was like, Oh, this is kind of wild, like, am I supposed to be here? And so I yeah,
Kristi Wagner 25:21
I think I got drawn to everyone. Oh, yeah. 100.
Jimmy Catalano 25:26
And so I think that when I was in high school, I loved being out on the water, I really found the role of coxing just made sense to me, I find it really cool when I can find something that like, works really well in the way that I like process things. Right? When I was when I was really, really young, I had like a processing issue in terms of like, like reading, I couldn't figure it out. I can read now, thankfully. But I really struggle with that. And so I think for me, and I was really embarrassed by it when I was a kid. And so I think for me, when I can like, really click into things that like, I know, my processing is right on, it's, it's really, it's kind of like finding a passion, right? It's kind of like that's something that generates kind of interest and keeps you excited, and that kind of stuff. And so for me when I was in high school, it clicked like it just really being out on the water, steering, motivating an athlete, working with a team, managing a group of people like that really, is the way my brain works. And I really, really enjoyed that. And so I think from there, this, this opportunity of getting recruited to an athletic through a school for athletics, when I was a kid was wait, like, I never thought about that at all. It never crossed my mind and it towards my junior year, I realized there was a possibility. And so I basically, you know, was like, okay, cool, I'm going to do this. And so I worked really hard, basically ended up, you know, getting recruited to a school that I loved. And so, you know, I thought that was awesome. And I was like, Cool, awesome. And so at that point, I basically figured, maybe I should try that. Maybe I could try the u 19. Team, right. And so I didn't get invited. And you know, I'm also quite stubborn in some senses. And that really pissed me off. Because it was just one of those things that I always remember just being like, if I just sat in that seat for 20 minutes, like, I know, I could do it, you know what I mean? I just I like, I could feel it. I was like, I know, I could do it. So I didn't get invited. And it really pissed me off. So I basically sat there. And I remember just being like, Okay, fine. I'm not going to union team team. I'm gonna go make the u 23. Team when I'm in college, and I basically sat down, and I wrote down all these goals that I had. And I basically figured out like, Okay, if I want to go to the u 23. Team, I need to, like, you know, do this, this, this, this, I need to talk to these people. And I wrote it all down. I think writing down goals is super powerful. And one of my coaches from high school kind of like, urged me to do that. And it was super helpful and beneficial. But I basically was like, This is what I'm gonna do. And let me tell you like that original list, I had to rewrite it and edit it multiple times. Like it didn't stick to that plan. But at least I had a goal and at least I had a direction to go. And by the time I was a sophomore, like one of the things was like, I have to, you know, I have to be in the varsity at Wisconsin, if I'm gonna get invited to the u 23. Team. And so when I was in the I was in the varsity eight, my sophomore year, and ended up, you know, working with Coach Clark, who basically wrote me a recommendation. And then I went to an ID camp out in Oakland, and I got to meet, you know, Coach TD, and it all kind of worked out quite nicely and got a recommendation, got invited to the 23 team in Seattle in 2019. And I was really young. And it was super naive, and it was probably a little too immature to be there. But you kind of build the plane as it takes off. And so I went out there, I only got voted a few times. You know, I kind of knew I wasn't really going to make it but I was like, Oh, well, it's cool to be here. It's me trying out for a junior like a you 23 national team. It's wild, you know, from the kid who got cut from the soccer team. And so I ended up getting cut. And again, it kind of pissed me off. I was like, if I just sat in that seat for 20 minutes, I know I could do it. And so then the next year, I was like, Okay, I'm gonna do it again. And I'm gonna like, figure it out. And maybe like some of the other older toxins were graduating too. So I was going to be on the older side. COVID happened. So I got invited, but not really. And so that was a bummer. And then my senior year, yeah, my senior year, I got invited again, I went out there, ended up making the Coxed four. And we raised at Worlds, one of the coolest experiences ever, I was like, This is absurd. This is crazy. But again, not being in the aid really pissed me off, because I was like, if I can be in that boat for 20 minutes, I can do it. it frustrated me that I you know, didn't I wasn't in a place where I wanted to be and so you know, again, you gotta keep working hard. So I went back to Wisconsin for my fifth year because I got a grad degree because of COVID which was kind of a silver lining of all that because that's again something that I never thought I would have ever had is you know, a grad degree in finance or private equity real estate but finance degree which I was poli sci undergrad. And so it's just kind of wild to me. I was going into my spring of my grad degree year, and I was just kind of looking at the thing, like looking at the makeup of the senior national team. You know, the idea that the, the Olympics was a year later now, so it was going to be like, graduate Olympics gonna be done, maybe there's going to be some movement and toxins and that kind of stuff. You know what I mean? So I was like, Oh, it's good. It's a real possibility, Yossi, you know, kind of came into the picture. And so like, kind of started talking to him and trying to figure out, you know, what, what his thoughts were, and I didn't know who he was, I didn't know who's going to coach it. So I was trying to figure out all these things all at the same time. And then basically, in that summer of 2022, pretty last minute, I got invited to go to the selection camp. It was basically that so Henley happened. I went to Henley, as a spectator came back from him, we I was living in Madison, I had a job in private equity, real estate, I kind of was like my rowing career is done, like, whatever. Or maybe I'll try next year, it was kind of like it wasn't done. Maybe I'll try next year. And then pretty much that email came through that was like, You need to be in Princeton on Monday. And I was in Madison working full time, you know, real estate job, okay. So I packed up my entire apartment in Madison, drove cross country dropped off my stuff at my parents house in Connecticut. And we drove off. And, you know, I ended up in Princeton on Monday. And you know, as the racing started, and, you know, that was kind of, and again, I knew it was a long shot. I was like, I don't I have no idea what's going to happen. I think what was super cool for me was, you know, I got that 20 minutes in the boat, like I did. And I knew it was going to work. I remember leaving selection camp in 2022, being like, I have showcased everything to my ability. And I know that like, if I don't make it right now, then I'm not ready to be on the team. And I can try again next time or, you know, whatever. But at least I felt like satisfied walking away that I had showcase everything that I could. And that's something that I hadn't gotten before. I think anytime I was in different situations, not that it was like, I'm not blaming anything, it's just like, I didn't feel super satisfied with the way that I performed and like the assessment that I had. And so I think that, uh, when I walked away from that, I was like, okay, cool, you know what I mean, and it ended up working out and it was great. And it's just kind of kind of the way it goes, and then made the team again this year. So I think it's, again, like we've talked about, it's really, really hard work. And you run into a lot of failures quite frequently,
Kristi Wagner 32:25
I did not know about the like, private equity job. And that's,
Jimmy Catalano 32:29
I, I ended up like, sort of quitting, I got to selection camp. And I was like, okay, like, I can do this, you know, it's going to be do and I also was working for them when I had gone to Henley. And I just basically didn't tell them and I was like, um, I'm going to Henley because I have to go kind of stretch the truth a little bit, and was like, I have to go for this rowing thing. But I'll do all my work. So I would go to the races all day long. And then all night, I would do my job. And I was really, really tired. And then I got back. And when I got to selection camp, I got there. And I just remember thinking, like, I really enjoyed private equity, real estate, and maybe something down the line that I'll continue to do. But at the time, I just remember, like, I can't do both of these things to the level of that I would want them to be at and that doesn't sit right with me. And so I had a meeting with my boss at the time. And it was like, he was like, yeah, go do that, that this will be here, forever, go do that. Totally fine. They were really, really nice about it. It just kind of the way it goes.
Kristi Wagner 33:30
I just kind of thought of this, but like you've worked with some very noteworthy coaches, the past couple of years. I mean, obviously, like everyone interacts with the coach a lot. And definitely one thing with the senior team is that and you 23 teams is that we're like, really quick get to know new code, you know, you have to like present yourself really quickly. But how has that kind of been like, I'm sure that all of these strong male coach, older coaches have kind of different, like, I don't know what the correct vernacular is successful. Like I bet they have different things they're looking for. So how has that kind of been like navigating that? Do you? Did you try to have conversations with them, like really early in the process?
Jimmy Catalano 34:20
I mean, even starting in my first 23 camp, you know, it was coached by Michael Kelly, I think that the biggest thing that I have tried to do when in these spaces with these new coaches is again, like, try to showcase who I am as a person, what I'm going to bring to the table and at the end of the day, I'm not trying to obviously like when you when you work with a new coach and you're trying to pick up like, the way they run their drills and the way they do this and that's totally fine. And you're gonna do that and you're gonna pick up on that really well but I also try to do this like, I think if I tried to just adhere to like the Coxon that they want, or they want you to be III or that kind of stuff, I just that doesn't really, it's not really the way that I like to play the game. And I think that if I can showcase to them like, This is who I am as a person, this is who I am as an athlete, and this is who I am, you know, what I bring to the table. And I think, doing that in a very present, and maybe not modest, but just not like cocky or arrogant, but competent, and, and calm. And I think that's kind of the best way that I've navigated, you know, so many different coaches, because they're all very successful in completely different ways. Like, I would not say that this coach was the same as this coach was the same as this coach, like, they all operate it in completely different ways. And, like we've said, there's different ways to coach, there's different ways to caucus, there's different ways to grow. And so it doesn't take away from any kind of success. And I think it's kind of the same way as I've always tried, you know, through this whole thing, because it's definitely sometimes it's very overwhelming at times, but tried to just stay true to who I am as a person and try to maintain, you know, being a good person, being competent, trying to learn as much as you can, and being being a student of the sport, no matter how high up, you end up, and having fun with it, at the end of the day, like what we get to do with so cool. And I just, you know, really have to remind myself, not really, but continue to remind myself how, what we do is super cool. And there's such a small amount of people who get to do what we do. And, you know, take the moment to realize what, what, uh, what, what joys we have, and what a what the sport has awarded us
Kristi Wagner 36:29
100% to shift gears a little bit, because I am like very interested in coaching. And especially now that you're like, Well, I was gonna work in. Yeah, how did? How did coaching happen? And how have you? How has it been?
Jimmy Catalano 36:46
At the time when I was in the spring of my grad degree year, I kind of had this idea where I was going to try to get a job in private equity, real estate, and then maybe see if I could volunteer coach somewhere anywhere. And I kind of decided I was like, Okay, well, it's either gonna have to be Oakland, Austin, or Boston. And those were kind of like the three places where I was like, I'll be able to find a ride with actually really private equity real estate job, and there's good rowing there. And I kind of had this idea where I was like, Okay, well, Boston kind of makes the most sense. It's close to it's close to Princeton, it's got many different universities, there's a lot of real estate there. You know, a large portion of my extended and immediate family lived near Boston. And so a lot of things just made sense. Like Boston kind of made a lot of sense to parents. So I had kind of had been asking around and kind of ended up in this different places. And so I kind of like reached out to Northeastern and was, you know, maybe like going to do a volunteer coaching and we had talked to the IRA that year, and you know, that kind of stuff. And then right before I left for, for the selection camp, my current one of our other coaches basically called me and was like, actually, we have an opening for, you know, a new assistant coach, is that something you're interested in? And I was like, I still had my job in private equity. I was like, alright, alright, you know, what's happening. And so I basically was just like, ah, can I call you in like, a few weeks? I, I have to go get cut from the senior national team before and they were like, Oh, well, you might make it and I was like, okay, so then Alex Perkins, who's the head coach at Northeastern called me he was like, yeah, like, this is something we're really interested in. And we, we understand that, you know, coaching is or coxing national team is, you know, kind of your main thing, but we'd love to have you and blah, blah, blah, ended up working out super great, like, the collegiate season and the senior national team season, at least the eights kind of season lines up really nicely. And for me, in this new system of, of small boats, and which I think is great, it allows people to, you know, have the autonomy to train where they want and all that kind of stuff. The one thing that really did stand out to me and kind of scared me it was like, you expect these toxins to show up to selection camp on right away steering everything, and don't get me wrong, you don't like lose your coxing ability, maybe after a few months, but like steering is not something that just like, if you don't do for a while, it's not just bam, you know, it's it definitely a little bit, you know, steering a 57 foot shell, with, you know, guys who are ripping it down the course it's not something that just comes super naturally. So that kind of made me a little bit nervous. And so I think the whole idea of like coaching and getting to see the boat from a different perspective and using different rhetoric and maybe popping in a boat from time to time if they let me really appealed to me so and I've taken that job I got back from worlds last year and I started right away, I went right up to Boston and started working. And it was a great fit. It was it was super super beneficial use of my time I basically would get in boats once a week once every other week and the guys loved it I for selfish reasons loved it because it allowed me to continue coxing at a really high level in terms of ability and athleticism and that kind of stuff. It's not just like I'm jumping in, you know, some masters boat that they're gonna just whatever, no shame two masters boats. I'm just saying. I think that was really, really helpful. And I feel like it's been really cool because it's allowed for me to to expand my knowledge of the sport and expand my communication regarding, like many different things that have applied well to the senior team, I think being on the launch. And having that perspective of, you know, not being in the boat and getting to see the boat from the side and managing a team. And using that kind of rhetoric has just been so helpful to the broad scale of being on the senior national team. And one of the coolest things that I really enjoy. And the challenge that was for me is the the whole coaching aspect of it. Coaching rowers wasn't really that it wasn't super easy, but it wasn't it wasn't like super unnatural to me, right? Like, I talk about the stroke when I'm in the caucus and see all day long. It's not like I don't know about the stroke and that kind of stuff, and I know what you're supposed to do. What was a challenge for me was actually talking to another Coxon about how to do what I want them to do. It's something that I have never had to do before, right? Like, yes, when I was in college, obviously, like, I'd work with the other toxins and but like, on the water, talking to a Coxon, about telling them to use their rhetoric to get something out of a bow is something that I've never had to do before. And I thought that was so cool, because I was like, whoa, this whole new experience of I'm not scaring I'm not talking. I've got to get them to basically do it on their own. And coach that into them was was a really cool experience. And I and I still do it all the time. And it's great. So I think having that experience has been super cool. It keeps it really fresh and fun and motivating to continue to get better.
Kristi Wagner 41:42
I was gonna ask you about like, not coxing for the whole year. And then to like jump in camp. Yeah. But kind of like, additionally to that I feel like a part of coxing is really like you are an athlete in the boat. Like it's a relationship with the other athletes. And has it been challenging? Like, we go to so many camps together throughout the year that you got, I mean, I think you were in Sarasota for what like two days like so briefly? Yes. Yeah. Two days, like, I hit like, was that a challenge this year? Or was it nice? Because you had coach and you didn't have to, like balance so much?
Jimmy Catalano 42:22
Yeah, I think that for me, personally, I think coaching was really good. For me, I think if I was just like doing a normal job, and not doing anything at all, I think that would really make me very uncomfortable. I definitely am very glad that I had, you know, the experience that I had last year, just throughout the year, I will say it's definitely very difficult at times, I've had to make many, many different decisions in the last 18 months regarding being on the national team and trying to make an Olympic vote and that kind of stuff. And most of the time, it feels like you're making the wrong decision, you know, whether that's someone legitimately telling you, you're making the wrong decision, or it just feels like everyone's in Florida, and you're no you're doing this or it's it is definitely really hard. And you kind of have to listen to your intuition. But I've learned a lot about kind of trusting your instinct. And it's hard. Like, it's really hard. I mean, I've definitely I've had people tell me that doing what I'm doing is not not going to allow me to be on the national team. And that's hard. Like you're a twin, I was like 23, you know, just barely made my first national team. And I'm being told I'm making the wrong decision. Like that's really hard to overcome. And it's, it definitely has forced me to trust myself more and kind of understand the people around you and what they're saying to you and how it relates to, you know, your goals. But I've definitely made it work. And you know, I've had really my two other coworkers, the two other coaches I work with are so supportive and super helpful. Like, last December, I went out to Oakland for like a week and a half. And then I went out to Florida for that time. And then at Thanksgiving, I went down to Princeton, I've made it work. It just like you said, like we talked about underlying theme is it's hard work and what's not always easy. And so if that's the theme of our podcasts for today.
Kristi Wagner 44:11
I feel like you've obviously talked about being like resilient. And I mean, I know that your guys result I worlds was like not what you would have wanted. But that being said, like, I feel like we can't change the past. And how has it been coming back from that? And like, have there been things that you're like, Okay, now, this is the path for the year ahead. And these are things that I want to improve upon. It definitely was really sorry, heavy hitting question. No, no,
Jimmy Catalano 44:42
no, you're so good. You're so good. I mean, if you asked me two weeks ago, I would say no comments, but I've had some time to think about it and kind of reflect and such. I think the result at Worlds was was pretty, pretty tough. And I think for the most part I think what was really hard hitting For a lot of us was just like, it wasn't super representative of kind of what we had done like this past summer, which is, you know, not an excuse, I'm not arguing against it, like the result is a result. And I think that's the way it goes. I just think it definitely stung because it just, it was just a bad race. And you know, that's really unfortunate. But that's the way it goes. And at the end of the day, if you look at a, quote, unquote, bad race, we're still four and a half seconds out of first, and that's four and a half seconds back is not qualified for the Olympics. And that's, that's the nature of senior elite level racing. So it's something you learned from that, I think, I think one thing that I've personally learned is just like kind of how you respond in those situations, and kind of the people around you, I had a really amazing family, I've really great friends, really great co workers, friends, but they're my co workers do. And, you know, there's just like, kind of the way that people react, like in those situations is super telling, and very, like, supportive, no matter what, at the end of the day, we're all just people trying to do a goal. And so I think, moving forward, we've kind of, we're gonna get to race and Charles, and I think that's going to be great. I think it's going to be a little bit different. We have two guys who are going to raise Pan Am. So we've got some people coming in, but it's a majority of the bow. And then we've had a meeting with Yossi regarding kind of, you know, where he sees the trajectory of this boat. And so you know, I feel pretty confident, they want us to race it fo Q ours, and so they're going to kind of select the boat, and, you know, hopefully, I can be in that boat again. Because, you know, I feel like, I started something when I was selected in 2022. And it's something that, you know, I'm not finished with and I think you're presented with these decisions. So is this worth it? Am I done is the world over because of this? It sucks. But it's, it's, you can either say, Yeah, I'm done. And this sucks, and it's over. Or you can like keep, like, we've talked about hard work and continuing to try again. Because this sport, I remember someone said to me right after the World Championship, they sent me a text and they was just like, This sport is brutal. And I was like, Yes, this sport is brutal. And so I think that's kind of like I'm optimistic moving forward, I think once we kind of set kind of the group that's gonna go and to like selection and kind of go to fo CQRS and kind of maybe reset and rethink some things. But I'm really confident. And I think that hopefully, I get another opportunity to be in the boat just because I know that it wasn't what I want to showcase and goals. For myself, personally, I'm just going to continue to try to keep the group and not just the eight, I'm talking people who are in contention for the eight, obviously, I think it's important to keep the group and the national team in general strong and together and positive. I think across sculling sweet men, women, I think it's really important to have kind of a united front as a national team, because I love going to like the racism feeling like, everyone seen her like checking their phones and be like, Oh, the, you know, the double did this. And I think it's like, it gives a little bit of like that college, something that I get like that I have at work. It's like that little bit of you know, camaraderie and that kind of rah rah that. I think sometimes we get away from because we kind of feel like it's it's a different, different sport. And it is a different, you know, level. But I don't think at a different sport, I think it's the same sport that you did in college, the same sport that you did in high school, and it's just a different level. And so that's something that I want to do, I want to make sure that moving forward, I feel like I am continuing to put the entire team's best interests at heart and make sure everyone feels that whether you're in the double the single day before, like, we can go and we can you know, be you know, this team that shows up to the Olympics next summer and has a good result and can feel like we put our stamp on it and we're successful. I feel like
Kristi Wagner 48:43
I've noticed a huge change with that. Like, I feel like it's so much more. There's so much more camaraderie now. And I feel like there is just genuine support and yeah, excitement and happiness, which is just so much more fun. It's so much more fun in that sphere. And I mean, you're right. It is just growing. And yeah, like we're all just the same. Yeah, little dweebs. We were in high school like, yeah, yeah. Well, we're almost at an hour, but is there anything I like didn't ask you about that. You You're like she should have asked me that. Anything else? Thanks. So
Jimmy Catalano 49:22
I really enjoyed this conversation.
Kristi Wagner 49:24
Yeah, um, the last thing is like if you have any questions for me, we sometimes do a ask Christy anything segment says basically, they have a question. It can be literally anything or nothing. Go
Jimmy Catalano 49:36
on. No, I've got it. I'm ready. I'm ready. If you can go. Okay. And you restaurant for dinner tonight. Where would you go?
Kristi Wagner 49:44
I don't know. Actually. I feel like I would go somewhere in Boston and have really good seafood. I don't necessarily know what restaurant I would go to but because I grew up outside of Boston, and yeah, sometimes I Love upstate New York but our seafood scene is not really it. And not this. I don't know, where would you go for dinner?
Jimmy Catalano 50:08
I would go to there's a restaurant in Florence called gar Gandhi's that I went to my brother was setting a semester abroad in Florence and like, me and my family to this day still talk about that restaurant and like, I would probably go there in just like a heartbeat. Like if I could just like be there. Oh, my God, be so good.
Kristi Wagner 50:29
I I need to have an answer like that. Thank you so much. I feel like you had so many awesome things to say I like yeah, I feel like people are gonna love this. So thank you so much,
Jimmy Catalano 50:40
so much. I really appreciate I had so much fun. And I'll see you at the Charles.
Kristi Wagner 50:43
Yes,
Jimmy Catalano 50:45
I can't wait.
Kristi Wagner 50:48
Thanks so much to Jimmy for coming on. And to everyone for listening. I feel like he had so many great things to say and like I was getting super inspired and motivated during my conversation with him. So I hope that everyone is you know, leaving the conversation feeling super inspired and motivated and ready to go conquer whatever you want to conquer. And with that I'm gonna leave you for the quote of the week, which I got from a real my dad sent me on Instagram, so shout out to my dad and Instagram rails. So the quote was, the magic you are looking for is in the work you're avoiding. So have a good week. Thanks for listening. See you next time. I'd love to hear from you. So send us a topic suggestion or if you'd like to submit a question for our Ask Christy anything segment, head to our website, the other three years.com
Transcribed by https://otter.ai