Inside the Olympic Journey with Sara Hendershot | Episode 50

*This Transcript is Autogenerated*

Sara Hendershot  0:05  
Essentially it doesn't matter what athlete you are, you need to be on this like list of Olympic candidates. First off, right you have to hit some like basic qualifications in order to be part of that group in order to really like put yourself in the ballgame. You have to have like competed at winter speed order you're gonna do national team testing throughout the year and previous year's International Competition is all like part of helping to create this Olympic School.

Kristi Wagner  0:27  
Welcome to the other three years a show for anyone who has an Olympic sized dream they want to turn into a reality. Hi, and welcome to this week's episode of the other three years podcast. This week I am joined by 2012 Olympian and now us rowing athlete representative and board member Sarah Hunter shot so Sarah had a very successful rowing career herself highlighted by a fourth place finish in the women's pair at the 2012 Olympics in London. And after retiring from rowing, she continued her work with us rowing as an athlete selected representative to the US board among a few other responsibilities, which she gets into during our conversation. And I wanted to have Sarah on the podcast this week to share some more info about the different paths to making the Olympic team and rowing and how the selection procedures that we all follow are put into place. Sarah has worked super hard to make the US rowing team more successful. Over the past few years, she's been helping this like whole quadrennial and I know a lot of the work she does is not even seen because it all happens behind the scenes. But the other current athletes and I are definitely reaping the benefits and really appreciate what she's been doing. So and the her and the other athlete representatives. And I loved hearing from Sarah on her own rowing career, and then her transition away from the sport as well. And I really appreciate her honesty and openness with me. And I think everyone will just really enjoy the conversation and learn, you know a bit about the different paths towards making the team. So before we get into that, here is an update on what's currently going on in my training. So very exciting news, the first athletes were named to the team and Sophia and I were named to the women's double. So we will officially be going to Paris to race in the double, which is really, really exciting. It definitely is still sinking in, I think it doesn't feel it's funny, like practices just kind of as normal, and everything is just kind of as normal. So it feels real, because I had a lot of confidence that that we would but I I don't know, it just also doesn't feel that real, because it just seems like we're just moving on to the next thing. But it is really exciting. And it's really fun to share in that excitement with friends and family. And I'm, I'm super excited that, you know, my family will be able to go to Paris because it was just a bit of a bummer that, you know, they didn't get to go to Tokyo, I think when you are lucky enough to be named to an Olympic team, like you can't do that without the support of so many people. And it's a bummer not getting to share in that success with other people that helped make it possible. And that's, you know, family, friends, coaches, teammates, like so many people, it takes a lot of help from a lot of people to accomplish a goal like this. And I just feel really, really lucky and grateful to have so many awesome people in my corner and to get the opportunity to keep training and to represent our country of my country, at the at the Olympics and you know, hopefully go really, really fast there. That's the plan. And you know, we're gonna keep working hard because we have some really big goals for this summer. And, you know, this is an exciting step and making the team is a big deal. I'm also really, really excited for Sofia, it's her first team and she 100% deserves it and has earned it and I think it's just, it's a really cool thing. You're an Olympian for the rest of your life. And I'm just really happy for her and really excited that I get to have this Olympic experience with her. I love the double I love being you know, getting to race with teammates, but still in such a small boat class. So it's really exciting. And a bunch of other athletes were named to the team, which is so exciting. So happy for everyone to other Yeah, women's crew alums, also named at the team, so really, really exciting. And you know, at the same time a lot of people didn't make the team and that's really hard as well. I know. I've been there. Everyone's been there and there's not really anything that you can say that makes it better. But you know, I think understanding that everyone's dealing with different things. And everyone's in different positions in their journey. And just, I've been really impressed with kind of the group as a whole being very, very respectful of everyone, like people having success and people maybe not achieving the things they want to achieve just everyone being really respectful and really supportive of one another. It's, it feels very healthy, I guess, just like for the group as a whole. So right now, we're just kind of back to training, we have an uptick in volume. So that's exciting. I think it's going to be a very sweaty and a very long, few weeks. But that's exciting. We are going to stay in Sarasota for the next three weeks, and then move down to Princeton, New Jersey, or move up, I guess, to Princeton, New Jersey, to start practice there in a few weeks. So yeah, it's been a long time in Sarasota, Florida. But it's been good, and I like it here. But I have to say, I am excited to get back to the northeast, even though I wouldn't say Princeton is really the northeast, but closer to the northeast. And also, we can only row 2000 meters here, like the course is only 2k. And at Princeton at Mercer, you can go a little bit further, if we go over to Carnegie, where the Princeton University is, you can go way further. So I'm definitely looking forward to that a little bit. But just trying to make the most of the rows we have left here. It has been a little bit windy this week. But all reports say it's going to be pretty windy at the Olympics. So I think just trying to make the most of it get better every day. You know, whatever that means that day. And yeah, just keep keep at it. Because that's all you can do. But you know, trying to take a little bit of time this weekend, celebrate the success, you know, when the the excitement because you have to do that. But of course keeping it just in check and knowing, you know, there's still a lot of work to do. So yeah. Now it is time for my interview with Sarah Hunter shot. And I hope you all like it. Yes, sir. Thank you so much for coming on. I'm super excited that maybe you could just start sharing a little bit about, you know, your involvement in the sport, like both, you know, as an athlete, but now still being involved with us rowing and like different capacities.

Sara Hendershot  7:27  
Sure. Yeah. I feel like an oldie. In this sport now, because I've been retired for let's see, how long is it since 2016 is when I retired. So it's like I'm definitely now a couple of cycles disconnected from my at the end of my rowing career. But you know, I had a pretty, I think, typical start to rowing and finding this sport that a lot of other people have where I happen to actually just wander down to my boathouse in high school. I was like a lifelong athlete and did not have a spring sport that I knew that I was going to play for sure. Because I was playing soccer in the fall and swimming in the winter. And somebody was like, Hey, you're a swimmer. You're tall, you got this aerobic base, go check out rowing, they've given out scholarships left and right. So it was like, Okay, sure. And truly like the rest is history from that point, because rolling was such a different experience and sport than anything else that I had ever dabbled in. And I loved that it was super obvious that however hard I worked was, however far I was able to take the sport. So I did the whole high school thing I ended up getting recruited to row in college and chose to go to Princeton, I unluckily was sandwiched by national championships in 2006, and 2011. And I my run was two dozen, seven to 10. So I'd like to say that I helped contribute to the 2011 one. But when I retired, because the national team was training in Princeton at the time, it was really right in my face, they're like seeing them every day get selected for the Beijing Games. And it really tempted me essentially to turn down a full time job offer and to throw all my eggs in this Olympic basket and see what I could do. And so that's what I did. I had two years to the games, from the time that I graduated to the time that we weren't going to hit London and had to basically like learn how to roll a pair had to learn to skull from scratch, and somehow managed to earn the position as our women's pair. And then we finished in fourth and it was like really frickin close by point two seconds. So that that whole experience got me on for like a second cycle of training. And that second cycle, I learned so much about myself and the sport and my body. Really that's where I developed my true passion for athletes and how to support them in all different kinds of ways. So that's the very long winded way to get to the point where after I retired in 2016, I knew that like I wanted to stay connected in some way but I just wasn't sure how. And I joined the board. And as an athlete representative in 2021, and my role has morphed since then I'm now the chair of our athlete Council. I'm also a representative to the usopc through that role, and so really, it's all about like, how can we support the experience of our of our national team athletes, and really give a voice to them in the rooms and in the conversations that matter and and impact and affect them. And so I've been doing that for the past four years. It's so I'm super pumped to that now we're finally like, almost at the finish line of, of this Olympic cycle. And we get to see all that work that we've, you know, tried to make this experience better for you guys, hopefully come out in your performances. Yeah,

Kristi Wagner  10:39  
I have questions about all of the things you've been doing more recently. But I do have to say, I remember watching, I was in college, and well, actually, I feel like we were watching it because you guys were racing, Jamie Redman, and the pair of pairs trials. But yeah, that race is like one of the best races I've ever seen, like, for I'm sure you can find it online for all the people listening, but that 2012 You can really,

Sara Hendershot  11:05  
yeah, because

Kristi Wagner  11:08  
so that slow was like, yeah, yeah,

Sara Hendershot  11:12  
I know. And so I actually I do these like little talks for this organization that trains tactical athletes. And I use that race as part of my talk, because I had to beg a friend at NBC to give me a copy of it, because otherwise, it's just doesn't exist anywhere otherwise. And every time I watch this race, I get full body adrenaline goosebumps. I've seen it, like over 100 times at this point, because I use it so often in that as a tool. And it's one of the most dramatic come from behind races that you can kind of imagine. And the whole time I'm watching this, I'm like, what were we doing? It's just crazy.

Kristi Wagner  11:47  
Yeah, you guys are like, almost open water down like

Sara Hendershot  11:51  
Oh, no to to boat legs open water down.

Kristi Wagner  11:54  
That's just insane. I just remember like, watching it and being like,

Speaker 1  11:59  
oh my god, this is the coolest thing I've ever seen.

Sara Hendershot  12:03  
Yeah, it was like one of those true stories of the races never over until it's over. Yeah. And then the other crazy part about that is there was like never a point in that race that I wasn't positive that we were going to win. Which sounds wild. Yep. So I loved that experience of being able to go and race in the women's pair, I raced with Sarah zelinka, we're still really good friends, she lives nearby me. So we get to see each other every so often. And I just love now being able to take that experience, what was good about that experience, and also what was not good. And try to impact some of the big decisions that US rowing is making to really improve our athletes chances having really good performances, but also it like being treated like a full person, and like a well rounded human as an athlete, because like, the hypothesis that we are leading with is basically like if you can make a person function better as a person, they're going to perform better as an athlete. Yeah.

Kristi Wagner  13:02  
I mean, I feel like there have been tons of changes, you know, in at least the last quadrennial, which I think Jozy brought around a lot of them. But I think a lot of them were sort of starting to happen even before he like came on staff. To me it it just sort of seemed like we were in a like we just couldn't keep it up. Like we couldn't keep the wheel was like running out, I guess so to speak, or like the barrel was emptying. I don't know if that's maybe how you felt. So you joined the board in 2021. Post post, pre pre Olympics, or post Olympic real Olympics pre Olympics. So what was that experience? Like? Kind of coming in at the very end of a cycle that obviously had an extra year? But

Sara Hendershot  13:56  
yeah, yeah. So it was chaotic. To say the least, because yeah, so typically, the way that these athletes 10 years are supposed to go is that you cover an entire cycle. And so you they kick over at the end of December. And that would be following an Olympic Games. And then you cover the four years that lead up into that game. So you go through the Olympics, and then the next December is the next election or the next round of athlete reps that might come in. And so when I came in, we had had this delayed Olympics. So we were in a totally different phase, right? Like it was still perform, but also in a way of like, hey, kind of just like patch on this extra year. Right. And I, I know talking to a lot of the athletes that were part of this, like totally dependent on what your situation was as to whether that year felt advantageous or really challenging. And so a lot of it was just like walking into the situation that existed already and figuring out like how to make sure that we didn't let the wheels come off and then wait Wait until we get through the Olympics to really take a look at like what's going on and what needs to be improved. And so it was still me bit getting to experience kind of the old side of the system, even though things Yes, probably were on their way to start to morph a little bit. And I view it the exact same way that you're you kind of described that Christie, which is like, all of a sudden, some of our problems were catching up with us, honestly, is is what I look at it like we were getting away with a lot, because we do have such a talented and huge country of athletes to pick from. And we weren't necessarily focusing on the right things, and all of a sudden, it was catching up to us. And so you don't want to like completely try to uproot a system right before the Olympics, right? You got to kind of like let for the for the athlete sake to let what's happening play out, and try to just make sure there's no massive emergencies and alarms that go up. And, you know, obviously, we got through that and came up short on the goals of the team for performance. But following that, it was like, Okay, here's our opportunity. Now we've got to we've got a new CEO, we've got a lot of contracts that are ending, on the staff side, we've got some turnover for athletes that are happening, how do we think about this entire system and the and the whole the whole ecosystem, and like what needs to actually change and be put in place to start to truly change the trajectory of this of this national team moving forward? How

Kristi Wagner  16:25  
much of a role does the board and did has the board had in that process? Yeah,

Sara Hendershot  16:32  
and honestly, too much, because it was a very active and, and honestly, like overly involved board, a lot of that came from just the culture of the group and the leadership. And that's one of the things that has improved so dramatically, is that now, the board is really sitting in the position that it's supposed to be sitting in which it's like we we are intended to oversee the financial health of the entire organization. And we are the boss of the CEO. That's really how our nonprofit board is supposed to work. So when big decisions come to the table that need direction, or guidance, that's how the Board should be used to help to give direction to help to give guidance. And then in places where people actually have a lot of expertise, we can help to drive projects forward, like things like finances, right, or marketing has been something we've been trying to help add support to big picture strategy, right. So those have been the places where we can, we can help to, like empower and give the tools to the US rowing staff to do that really well. But it's not the job of the board to get in there to do that, or to medal. And the same goes for the high performance committee, because in the past, the high performance committee was a very, very involved was the ones that were actually writing the selection procedures that were signing off on all of the selection. And now they're really supposed to be consultive. And that's that's what they are. The high performance director is the one that orchestrates the vision for all of this system and the selection. And he then gets to use the high performance committee, as a consulting panel basically to say, Does this check out? What am I missing? Where are there gaps in this, and that is now functioning so much stronger, so much more functionally? Just in general? Right. And I think we've got really good people in place across all those positions.

Kristi Wagner  18:16  
Yeah. So you Jozy or whoever the high performance director would be writes the selection procedure, and then brings it to like the high performance committee and basically is like a check, or like a consultant, like you said,

Sara Hendershot  18:33  
Yeah, and you know, that's, that's what a high performance director is intended to be across any of these national governing bodies. It's their job to create a high performance plan that then is executed by that national governing body, right. So that's really the first step is that Yosi sets a high performance plan? Like here's what I envisioned for this team, and the structure of our system. And so that's what he started with was like, Okay, how am I going to handle basically training centers versus like satellite high performance groups? How am I going to try to, like, bring athletes together versus allow them to have independence through that? How am I going to support them through resources he did. He did all of that, and continues to do that regularly. Then when it comes to specific selection for a world championship year or for an Olympic year, he's the one who writes those procedures. And then he brings them to the high performance Committee, which is a panel of six people, two of those people are athletes, and essentially presents them and says, like, what do you think? And they have discussions, and sometimes there are changes that are made every time that we've written or that they have written selection procedures. Now they've brought it to the community as well and asked for feedback. There's like an open comment period, there have been numerous times where open comments have been provided that have then changed the selection because there have been things that either were slightly missed or are not thought of totally or just the response of the athlete community was strong enough that we're like, Okay, this doesn't make sense then for us to do and then Yossi would alter it. The highperformance committee would approve that up, and then and then it's sent to the usopc for review, they ultimately end up being the ones that are the final check. And sometimes there, they have sent things back as well. They're like, this isn't clear enough for the athlete, you have to adjust it. And then once that's all done, then it finally gets published for the athlete. And that's what we stand by, you know, for that upcoming year.

Kristi Wagner  20:18  
Okay, yeah, I was gonna ask who the final like check was because I just, in my own personal experience, like last year, I remember in the first iteration of the selection procedures, the women's double was not a trials boat. And then it became a trials boat. So I assumed that that was due to either feedback from, you know, the community, or I don't know, I you know, but um, I think that's a pretty big change. Yeah, an example of you know, what you're talking Yeah,

Sara Hendershot  20:51  
that is a that is a good example of a big change. And you know, what I would say about that one, as, as an example, I think it's a combination of things that ended up that ended up making that shift. But one thing that Yossi is doing differently than what we have done in the past few cycles is he's looking at the athlete pool as a whole, rather than specific boat classes that he's trying to fit people into. And that's really one of the biggest changes, I think around how we're doing selection this year. Last time, we'd be like, Okay, we're trying to win the eight. How are we going to put eight people, our best eight people into that boat to win it? And now it's much more about how strong is our athlete pool? How strong can we make that athlete pool, and then where's our best chance to win medals based on who those athletes are and what their strengths are? Right. And so that could look completely different year to year. And so, and so I think some of that was like he was thinking through what this Olympic pool of athletes looked like, and where he wanted to put resources. Some of it was community feedback. But yes, ultimately, the usopc is the final check on all of that, because they are the stewards, essentially, for fairness, and for athlete experience to ensure that, that there aren't like laws, honestly, that are being broken in that process. Because we have to, we have to, like, you know, be able to uphold what Congress has set out for us. And a lot of these rule sets as well. Yeah,

Kristi Wagner  22:17  
it was explained to me, and I feel like it had this has been true, like, kind of in the previous systems, selection camps were mostly designed to like, weed out numbers 15 through 18, you know, like, it was all focused on the quote, unquote, bottom kind of group of people. And now maybe camps are designed to find who the top four people are, or, you know, whatever. So that, like you said, those people can then be put in the best situation possible, so that the country is put in the best situation possible to try to win win medals. And like you said, that's different year to year. But it's definitely been a pretty big change.

Sara Hendershot  23:00  
I totally, yeah. And I see it as like Yossi is playing a game of chess to Yeah. Because that's the other part is that he is so in tune with what's going on internationally for each of these other bow classes that that he's looking at that to help make decisions, right, like, Okay, do we think we have a better chance at winning against the competition that we know is entered in the women's double or the women's for right? And if there are athletes that could do both things are like, let's be really smart about how we develop them, or how we position them, and then how we ultimately select them. But you're right, I think that that is a big shift of thinking about like, how do we optimize versus how do we just like, cut the remaining, and I give a ton of credit to Yossi on this one as well, because that's a cultural shift where we had to, we had to switch from thinking about being defensive in the selection process to thinking about being offensive. And some of this was like reactionary to situations that had come up in the past where athletes had been really upset about selection results, and not at all to their fault, because there were a lot of problems with the process. But that sometimes there were like suits like lawsuits that were then enacted because of that. And previous leaders wanted to really protect against that from happening. And so would select in a way where they could cover those types of issues. And Yossi came in was like, we cannot select our team that way, because we're never going to be able to optimize and to win, we have to be able to play offensively and we just have to change the experience and the process enough for the athletes that we're they're never going to be in a situation where we, they they feel that that has to happen. selection has to be transparent enough, the entire, like, allocation of resources has to be clear and fair. And if that happens, like we shouldn't ever get ourselves into a case where there needs to be a lawsuit because you know, the process was was handled properly, right. So I give him a ton of credit for that big shift, because that is a, that was a really, really big, hard, challenging thing to do that was pretty deeply rooted into the system at that point.

Kristi Wagner  25:06  
Yeah, no, definitely. So just like maybe to back up a little bit, because it is very confusing how all these votes are selected, even like for us to explain to people, maybe if you can just like big picture, because I know there is a very handy diagram that explains like all the different ways that you can qualify for the Olympics in rowing. Yes,

Sara Hendershot  25:32  
yes, correct. I can give an overview, and then any area that you feel like we need to dive in, please let me know. Yeah. So I would say really, there's, there's two main channels to make the Olympic team with, and then two paths, basically, that those channels feed. And so those those big pads are essentially like has the boat qualified for the Olympics, the actual boat class, right or not. And if the boat class has already qualified for the Olympics, it's a much simpler, more straightforward path to make the Olympic team. If the boat has not qualified for the Olympics, that has to be the final step that's completed is essentially, we have to then go out and go to the final Olympic qualification regatta and earn that right to send a boat in that boat class against other competitors. So that's like, those are the two big kind of paths that we're trying to feed. And then within those, there's two different ways to essentially get named within within a path. Either you are named the team through a selection camp, or you are named the team through trials. And that's something that has always been part of our system, it's been that way for as long as I know where, you know, there are certain boats that just make more sense for us to select from a pool of athletes and have the coaches and the high performance director actually like pre the combinations and put the top athletes together into a lineup and say you are named because we are saying that you are on the team. I'm writing your name on a piece of paper, you go up on the wall, and now you are an Olympian by that act. Alright, so that's one group of of boats. And then the trials group of boats are a different set, where for the most part, they've always been small boats, we're on that day that an Olympic trials is hosted, you have to show up. And if you win, and you're Val ball comes across that finish line first, you are the Olympian in that boat class. And that's how I was named to the Olympic team, because the women's pair ended up going to trials that year. So that's like the really big picture, right of like these couple of pads and the two different ways that you navigate those pads. And so we have a different route, essentially, that's being followed for each one of our boat classes, both on the senior side. And as to whether you you're going to make the team through selection camps or trials, and then do you have to go to that final Olympic qualification regatta or not?

Kristi Wagner  27:59  
Yeah, I feel like it's pretty, you know, it is kind of similar to how it's been in the past I'd say the thing that is a little bit different is also except for the men's aid boats that have to go to the final Olympic qualification regatta also have to race at trials. So like the men's and women's quads, although there is a selection camp happening and a selection camp is selecting a boat, which will hypothetically you know, race at trials and went like they do still have they will still race it Olympic trials. So like the I guess, door, whatever is open for other athletes to also race.

Sara Hendershot  28:39  
Right? So okay, so we can get a tiny bit more granular and that's helpful. And then you you correct me, Christy, if I say anything's wrong, because I know that it's so you're so close to it right now that you would have like the full picture as well. But essentially, it doesn't matter what athlete you are, you need to be on this list of Olympic candidates. First off, right, you have to hit some like basic qualifications in order to be part of that group. But in order to really like put yourself in the ballgame, you have to have like competed at winter speed order, you're going to do national team testing throughout the year and previous year's International Competition is all like part of helping to create this Olympic pool, right of athletes. And from that pool, then there were selection camp invitations that are made, right. And so once at that selection camp, there's three different paths that you might follow. You could be named directly to a boat, right? That's the men's for the women's for the women's eight, and the lightweight women's double, and the women's double the women's double Yes. And then you could be nominated to go to trials, which is the women's quad and the men's quad out of that selection camp. The selection camp is going to nominate a group that has to go to trials and race, or you could be the men's eight, and you're going to skip that step and go straight to final Olympic qualification Regatta. For trials then there's two different things that could happen. You could race it trials, and you could automatically win that race and be named to the Olympics. And that's going to be for all of the vote classes that are already qualified, right? So that's the men's pair, the women's pair, the women's single, or you could win that Olympic Trials race. And then you have to go to the final Olympic qualification Regatta. And each one of those have a different placement that they have to reach in order to then earn that spot. So when they cross that finish line in the correct placement or above that correct placement, then they have made the Olympic team. Yeah, right. And so it's a long road, right? And we're not there yet. And we are just now wrapping up this selection camp phase, which was happening pretty much all of March, and then the next phase and a few weeks. Couple weeks. Actually, it's gonna be here real quick. Are the Olympic trials. And that's down in Florida again.

Kristi Wagner  30:47  
Yeah. Yeah. Yes. You were correct in that? Did it great. Yeah. That was very impressive. But it is I, it is a little bit confusing, especially then the step of have previously qualified have not previously qualified. And the reason that like the men's and women's are not exactly the same, because I think some people have had some questions about that is because like, I think, for example, the lightweight men's double, and the Openweight, men's double, versus the lightweight women's double, and the Openweight, women's double, the women's boats pre qualified at the world championships last year, the men's boats did not. And that's why they are going their trials, boats and the women's aren't because I think that's like a little bit confusing for people when the two genders don't match up. Correct,

Sara Hendershot  31:33  
right. And that's another example is the men's eight, right? Because you have to go and qualify still, and the women's don't. And so that that all plays into that stats theme, though, that we mentioned, which is Yossi is looking at where's our best chance to win medals, right? Because if you qualified last year, that means that like you're at the top of the heap against the international competition right now, not to say that we can't have a boat qualify through final Olympic qualification and still be a big contender for a medal like that has happened. It's rarer, but it happens. But he's looking at like, where's our best chance and our best chance is, in a lot of cases, these boats that have pre qualified and that he can then put the depth of talent into those seats and see what we can do. Yeah.

Kristi Wagner  32:15  
I'm trying to think of how to phrase this question, but I find it very impressive, like all of the athlete reps, but like, you guys, how hard is it to kind of compartmentalize is maybe not the right word, like your own athlete experience, with then having like this huge picture of all of these book classes and all of these genders and para and seeing your team, you know, like, how hard is it to have your own experience, but then be tasked with? You know, thinking more broadly of like the big, the big experience of all of these different athletes and

Sara Hendershot  32:56  
everything? Yeah, yeah. It's not hard anymore. But it was hard initially, the further your own athlete experience becomes from present day, the easier it is to be able to take a little bit of like a big picture, look at all of this. That's one of the reasons why I think it is so challenging to be an active athlete and be an athlete rep. Right. And I've seen athletes do that. And they have done incredible jobs. But it is a really heavy load. Because it's almost impossible to separate that experience, then because you're in it, and you're seeing it happen every day. And then you're also helping to influence this big picture stuff. And so I think what we've learned is that retired athletes have the ability to like really impact in a super positive way, because they can have enough space from their experience to like, have some perspective, and they're not currently being impacted by whatever is, you know, being implemented. But we still need the current athlete experience included. And so like we've made a very, like big push to ensure that that still exists. And one example of that is the athlete Council, which if people don't know about, I'll give the really quick spiel on the usopc in 2021, required every NGB has to have an athlete Council within their within their sport. And that means you have to have a group of athletes who are less than 10 years away from their like final competition, that are going to help to like be liaisons to the staff and to the board into any big decision makers. And so they give you some like flexibility around how you can build that group. And they say, I think it can be anywhere between six and 12 athletes. So we decided to make our 10 athletes because we pull eight of those athlete reps directly from other pre elected positions. And then we use two positions to round out the group. And so when we pulled those eight, this this cycle, we had one active athlete out of that group, we were like that's not enough. We need to be able to hear more directly From the population, like what's going on on a regular basis, so we use one of those other positions to pull in another active athlete? And so yeah, I think that's, again, the long winded answer for you on it is now like a lot easier. But still a bunch of that is because I've done a ton of work on myself and like how I view myself as a person, and not just as the athlete that I once was, and like separating yourself from that experience, takes time and work and like distance helps, in a way. I think so. Yeah, that's my take on it. I

Kristi Wagner  35:37  
mean, I find it very impressive. I don't know, I feel like it's really hard. Like, even, you know, whatever. When I made the team and 2021, I raced to the trial, and you race to the trial, and you're the best on that day. And that's how you make the Olympic team. And it's very clear cut, you know, and I think it's been challenging. Like, we train a lot with the lightweights who made the team in the same way. And it's been very weird for all of us to now be in the selection camps, like, we were previously very separate. And it's, I don't know, it's just really hard to, like, take yourself out of what your own personal experience has been even, you know, even if it's maybe better for the future or whatever. I don't know, I'm just like, I don't know, if I could maybe long way down the line, like play some sort of role. But it feels very close to me still. And but I've yet because you're in it, because I'm in it. But it's like, I'm just so impressed with all of the athlete reps. Because I feel like we have for reference we have these monthly calls monthly, which are awesome. Like they the athlete reps Come on, and answer like questions that people have and give information and stuff. But I don't know, I just never see any, like bias and what anyone has to say or I don't know, I just find it very. I'm very impressed with all of you, guys.

Sara Hendershot  37:03  
Yeah. Well, thanks. I think that's great to hear for the whole group. I think that's one of the reasons why like, we have a great group of athlete reps right now. But that's one of the reasons why it's so important for our national team, athlete population to be engaged in that process is because you all have voted eight out of the 10 of us, right, you voted us into those roles. And so that is a big part of it, right? Like you chose the people that hopefully you believed could do that could could be impartial, to their own experience, who wouldn't come in, like, you know, with a chip on their shoulder or feeling like they they had something to prove that they didn't get to do as an athlete or something, right. And so I think we've got athletes who really all have the right mission in place here. But I also think time away from the sport has helped me to realize that every athlete, and every situation is going to be so different. And you can't just expect that What did work before is going to work now. And like that's life in general, right? Like something that worked for me last year might not serve me now. And I've got to find a way to let go of that thing that doesn't serve me anymore and continue to move forward. And so I think like, that's something that actually the system is doing really well right now is recognizing that. Not every athlete needs exactly the same thing, right? Like, we've created a system now, that doesn't force every athlete to fit into a box that says, like, you have to be able to work in this city. And with this coach, and with this type of training, like you have the ability to actually impact some of that and have it fit you as a person. And what you need right now might be different than what you need in four years from now. And we're trying to, like allow that to actually happen and exist. And so yeah, I think like, that's something I use, and I think about in my own, like, just personal life now. And it's totally relevant to the athletes experience, too. Yeah,

Kristi Wagner  38:58  
I feel like, at least it seems like there's been a lot more conversations about like athlete retention and how to keep athletes around longer, like making just the whole thing, a more sustainable life, which I have to assume that like you guys have played a big role in as well. Not that I don't think he knows he knows how 2030 year old Americans you know, want to be living their lives, but I don't know. I'm just interested in like those conversations and why what success looks like there.

Sara Hendershot  39:32  
Yeah, retention is definitely a big topic. We're talking about it a ton right now, right? Because we're right at this like inflection point where people are gonna start to make decisions. And you know, we survey you athletes every year and this like massive survey that we've done. This year was the second year that we've put it out now and we finally I feel like have a system for this. That's that's really helpful in that like we had a professional surveyor help us to build this list of questions so that we can compare the answers year to year and actually be able to see trends and changes that are happening over time. And one of the questions that we asked this year was, what's your plan after Paris? Right? Like, are you planning on retiring? Are you definitely planning on staying on? Or are you somewhere in between, and the majority of the group was somewhere in between either like completely undecided, or leaning a little towards saying, or leaning a little towards retiring. And that for us is like, whoa, like big opportunity for us to try our very best to sway all of those to stay on, right? Because the longer that we can keep somebody's career going, the better chance for them to metal, and Yossi has this awesome, like really cool data on how many years of training, it takes an athlete on average, to win their first Olympic medal? The answer is, the longer you stay in, the better your chances, right? So we want to be able to do that. And you're not going to be able to do that if you don't allow your athletes to have a sustainable life. So you're right, we have totally given a lot of perspective on that of what we think is necessary to provide that a lot of it again, comes down to culture, like the allowance of having a life outside of sport, whether that's with a partner, with a job with your family in general, right. Like, when I was an athlete, I didn't feel like that was really allowed, or respected or supported. I didn't feel like any moment with my partner, because I was with my now husband at that time, and I had to put him way, way last, and you know, that you're going to have to at some point in your Olympic journey anyway, but like that, that was not something that I was going to be allowed to develop. And it was absolutely part of my decision to retire was that it was like time to prioritize my relationship. And so those are all components of it. But you're gonna see this come to life in a lot of different ways. Like our Olympic trials that are coming up in what are we flex 15 days out or so you're gonna see six Olympic athletes, or former Olympic athletes there as athlete representatives there to be supportive of the athletes that are racing, and not even really with a focus on the ones that win. But more. So the the focus on the ones that don't win, because those are the ones who are potentially having their entire career come to an end in that moment. And if they choose to retire, and like that's their move, then we want to make sure that they have the support that they need to actually like, go out and navigate the world well, and if they're not sure, we want to make sure that they feel like they are seen, because that's one of those things that like we all as athlete reps that are retired now had poor experiences with when we were rowing, where it was like the day that you're done, it's just like, Okay, bye, you can't do anything else for us anymore. Like, we're not going to interact with you, we're not going to support you. It's like you don't exist. And we really want to make sure that nobody feels that way. And we're hopeful that that can help improve the experience enough that it's like a contributor, you know, towards retention to.

Kristi Wagner  42:56  
Yeah, well also, I think, or maybe it's still in the plan, but Jozy, I think was saying he's going to send like development squads to Henley this summer, which I feel like that's like, an awesome thing for you know, athlete development and hopefully, like athlete retention with people that, you know, will potentially play like, really, really big roles in 2028. And maybe just aren't, you know, are either recent college grads or whatever it is. I don't think anything like that happened in 2021. So, no,

Sara Hendershot  43:28  
yeah, some of that was a circumstance. Yeah, but

Kristi Wagner  43:35  
ya know, I mean, I don't think anyone from us rowing asked me if I was gonna keep rowing after the Olympics. Like I don't. I don't. I mean, Greg Stone did, but I don't think he works for you throwing stuff, which that's just an interesting fact. Right? Like, I don't know, I feel like I had never really thought about it. But that's probably a bit of an oversight.

Sara Hendershot  44:01  
Yeah, totally. It definitely is an oversight, right? Like, because our athletes are like our most valuable resource when it comes to our national team, they are the whole resource, right? So I think just thinking about those small details, as honestly goes such a further way than anybody can give them credit for. And when you've been in that experience, and you haven't had it, I think it's a really great place then to be able to be like this would have mattered to me, this would have made a totally huge impact on my life and my headspace, and what I did next, and those are small things that we can provide in this role that are easy to do. So yeah,

Kristi Wagner  44:37  
that's, that's awesome. How do you see like, your role, you know, continue and within us growing like, do you want to stay involved? Do you feel like you need a little bit of break? It seems like a pretty big time commitment.

Sara Hendershot  44:53  
So it's completely volunteer, right? Like we don't get paid for any of this. And I would say like, it averages throughout The year well, I mean, it's a flux, it fluctuates, the time commitment. Like I would say, some weeks, I give as little as like two hours to these projects. And there have been weeks where I give 20 hours of work because we're in selection or there's an athlete grievance, or there's something like super serious that's going on that needs a lot of support. And I'm like working serious overtime, right. So that's mostly because I'm the chair of the athletic committee. But I would say like, I have loved these for years. So so much, and I've gained so much like myself, personally, from the experience, especially sitting on the board, it has been such a professional development opportunity for me, being able to learn from the other board members who all come in with like incredible business experience, just being able to like have a playbook now for how I want to carry myself in different situations. It's been so incredible. So I will have my term ending in December. And I would like to probably run for another term, I have to be elected by our athlete pool again to do that. But I've always said like the second that I am no longer the best fit for this role, because there's a younger athlete that has closer experience to what has happened and is a little bit more relevant. That is the time that I'm like is I need to step away in this position because somebody can do it better. So I think we'll see as we get closer to December, what that actually means. I definitely want somebody else to take over the athlete council chair position, because that one needs to have more rotation to it. It's pretty heavy and it's lift, but I've loved this. So yeah, I like I'm going to try to find a way to stay involved in some capacity. That's

Kristi Wagner  46:32  
awesome. Yeah, that's great. I do remember when Jozy first came on. He was like trying to convince all of you guys to come out of retirement. Oh,

Sara Hendershot  46:41  
yeah. Yeah, he was like, I have a great experience of taking mothers and bringing them back into shape. Like we could do that. And the women's for is an Olympic vote now. Do you want to go for it? Yeah, he tried it. And like that was honestly a little bit tempting. Like, dang. Like, it'd be so fun to be able to roll under this system. But ya know, not gonna now for me is like hard.

Kristi Wagner  47:03  
Yeah, no, I'm just have a couple more questions. But I was kind of wondering like, at times, are you like, Oh, I wish I could row in this system. Because now you've played such a big role. Like, it's, I don't know, might be sad that you don't get to experience like what you've worked for. I mean, you are a huge part of it. And I'm sure you know that. But you're not living like the day to day in the boats in the system.

Sara Hendershot  47:30  
Yes, there's a little bit of bitter sweetness to it sometimes. But honestly, what that means is like, cool, we're on the right path to have, like, done what we actually set out with our mission to do. But I'm not the only one who has said that in athlete meetings before where somebody will be like, God damn, I wish that I got to do this now. And so yeah, I think there's like, there's always parts of that, like, you're gonna feel like that forever. Like, you're gonna watch a race, you're gonna be like, Oh my god, I remember how great that felt to be there. And that's the part that I missed the most. I missed the racing, I loved racing, like more than anything, I would do anything to get back on that starting line in the same peak form that was when I was and just get to go and like lay it all out there. Because like that, is there's nothing more fun than that. I think it's everything else that comes with it that I'm like, No, I'm good. Because the training is what you're doing like 95% of the time and it is not for the weak of heart right and so I got six years of that in my life that was really incredible and amazing and so many different ways. But I'm happy to be kind of in the next phase of life where where I get to experience and do things that I didn't get to do at all as an athlete so that part of me like is an easy way to remind myself like no it's okay I'm good

Kristi Wagner  48:48  
Yeah, and you can always race at the head of the Charles

Sara Hendershot  48:50  
which I do and take very serious Oh yeah. You popped into one of those alumni eights yet

Kristi Wagner  48:55  
i point I have but we have big plans for next fall so they will watch out I've been I will take it very seriously.

Sara Hendershot  49:04  
This is the best part I think about head of the Charles alumni eights is that the top group of boats now stack their lineups with as many Olympians as they can add as many young like current national teams as they can and then there is so much you know like talking about like who's going down and how you weren't good in college and how you're not going to be good now and like fun joking stuff. But yeah, I'm like 100% common for you.

Kristi Wagner  49:32  
Yeah, well, it was so funny. My dad I think was like I don't know why we brought it up I said something about it and he was like you're not going to try to win the $10,000 in the single and I was like no I am sin six seed and that alumni aid and having the time of my life like if I've learned anything It is that

Sara Hendershot  49:55  
good. You know what, when you're when your operation gold money, yes And then enjoy your alumni.

Kristi Wagner  50:02  
Exactly, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. can't put a price on fun. Awesome. That's awesome. Yeah. I don't know. Is there anything I didn't ask you about that? You wanted to talk about or mention? I know, there's a lot of other ways we could go. But

Sara Hendershot  50:19  
yeah. You know, in your note before this talk about, like, what other things we might want to talk about, it made me start to think just a little bit more about, you know, like, what would I tell myself or any athlete who's in selection camp right now, right like that, I wish that like somebody else had said to me, and I think everything that you and I just talked about with the path that people will end up going down, right, like, you might make the Olympic team, you might have an incredible experience in Paris, and you might choose to retire or continue on after that, right. Or you might be on the other side of that, and not make the team and also be really on the fence about what you're going to do next. And the emotions that come with any part of this are a lot to navigate i because you put every part of yourself into this process you that's what you guys do every day you wake up and you give absolutely every part of who you are towards this effort to be the best athlete you can be. And when that's over, or when that's at an inflection point, where you're trying to decide what path you go down. There is a lot of heaviness that can come with that, because it really causes you to look at yourself and like your whole life. And I think I would really encourage everybody who's going through that in the next few months to like, take that process seriously. And like let yourself have the time to like really be self reflective. Right. And like us, people who have gone through that experience before to hear what helps them and what worked for them. Because there's a lot of great I think experiences that you could draw upon. But it's, it's not going to be something that you can like quickly tie a bow on and just like move past, I thought my retirement was gonna go so seamlessly because I had everything set up perfectly, right. Like I had a job waiting for me, I had an apartment in Boston waiting for me, I had like, my husband was gonna move there with me, I was like, I've got this, like, my transition is going to be easy. And then it was very challenging, because I had to re identify myself, I had to completely start to think about myself differently and understand the nuances of who I was as a person. And that took me a couple of years. And like, honestly, it's still it's like an endless pursuit. Like I'm still working on myself, and like constantly learning about how I tick and like, parts of me that worked as an athlete that are not going to work as a mom. And I think it's such an opportunity. And like we as athletes just are wired basically to constantly evolve, and like try to improve ourselves. And that improvement process looks different post sport, so yeah, I guess, like I'm a resource to anybody who ever wants to talk about that stuff. And I want to make sure like, that. I'm like, an open door kind of with that.

Kristi Wagner  53:05  
Yeah, as well. No, that's really, that's really nice. I mean, I think it's, it's so interesting, like, everyone is so different. And even just like some people really want to have a plan. Some people don't want to have a plan, you know, like, and I? Well, first of all, I've learned you can never say never, like that is not a good path to go down. But I definitely am going to spend time this fall just evaluating and whatever. And I'm like, I just need to have no expectations on how that's gonna go for myself. And that's totally different from, you know, other people that maybe have already, you know, figured out exactly what they're going to do and where they're going to, you know, I don't know, it's just, it's, it's interesting how different people are and how, but I agree. I'm like, I don't know if that's gonna help. I think it's still gonna be hard.

Sara Hendershot  53:59  
Yeah, I think I think there will be challenges to it, probably that you don't anticipate completely. I think it's great that you're going in and like honoring what you know, you need already, like, I'm just going to, like, be prepared for anything, basically, that hits me through that phase. I'd also totally encourage you to, like lean on the support of like, professional people in that experience. Because like sometimes just having a mirror that like helps you walk through the situation can really streamline that process. And like that helped me immensely when I finally realized like, Okay, actually, like need to get therapists and like, talk to them about all of this because this is trickier than I thought.

Kristi Wagner  54:35  
Yeah. Yeah. I think when you're really in it, it's hard to see. Like, I hear you being like, you guys wake up and give everything and I'm like, Well, yeah, but that's normal. You know, like, I think when you're in it, it just seems like Well, of course that's what you do. And it's not that weird and all that but I think it is a very different way of living. thing

Sara Hendershot  55:00  
it is and and you have so many reps now of doing that the the giving everything that you're doing is often in the form of what you're not doing even more so than what you are doing, right? Because you've gotten really good at forcing out the distractions or just like saying no or building your life to never let them even like encroach in, alright. And then when all of a sudden those barriers come down, and there's a million different things that can come in and like try to take your attention, your time, your energy, that becomes like a completely different juggling act. In some ways, I look at my time training, and I'm like, God, that was so much easier than being a working mom, because there were less decisions to make once you create the structure in your life for that, but the saying no to like everything outside of that is so disciplined. That's like such a disciplined act. And you guys have gotten really, really good at doing that. And that's why you're gonna go and like have great performances. And if he wants,

Kristi Wagner  56:03  
hopefully, yeah, no, we will. We will. Cool. Thank you so much for coming on. I don't know if you have any questions for me taking up a lot of your time already. So happy.

Sara Hendershot  56:13  
Are we supposed to end with me asking you? We can't? Yes, we

Kristi Wagner  56:15  
definitely can do that. My producer will be so pleased.

Sara Hendershot  56:18  
Okay. Yeah. No, I definitely have a question for you. So, okay, this is going to be kind of a deep one, though. But so when you close your eyes at night, and you picture, like, what it's gonna feel like to race at the Olympics, like what, what is part of that vision for you? For Paris? Like, what? What is it that feels different and new this time?

Kristi Wagner  56:45  
That's a that is a deep question. No, that's a good question. I think, I think for me, personally, like making the Olympics in 2021, was very exciting, like, kind of like what you said, my first international race, and the pair was the heat, like, we did go to a World Cup, but it was very, like new and everything was not like fly by the seat of your pants, because I did feel prepared. But it was all sort of like a blur. Like I was like, just keep going because this is a once in a lifetime experience of like, you just have to make the most of it. And, you know, I really, I believed and I still believe that we, on a different day might have, you know, gotten a medal. And you know, we gave everything we could in the final and you know, you have to believe Right? Like you do this time around. It's just been different, I think in how much preparation like we've had and how much honestly support like the small boats and the sculling team has had and maybe it's because Jozy has given us so much of that support. I definitely feel like there's maybe just a little more like faith and trust in me and Sophia and and our boat class like that. It's not surprising when we are going really fast GMs or it's not surprising when we're having a good day, like, you know, last year at Worlds, we had the fastest time in the semifinals. And that was maybe not a reality like that I had seen for myself before. But I also wasn't like, wow, shocking. I was just like, yeah, so I just think maybe there's a little bit more confidence in how high I think my ceiling is within the sport these days. And it's just easier to my college coach used to say this thing of like, don't feel like you need to go and have an amazing race, like you're good enough is good enough for today. And I sort of feel like are good, you know, because we're doing all the work. And we've had enough time and had enough prep and all of these things like good enough is good enough. And that doesn't the Olympics take it takes having your best day on the best day. But there's just maybe a little bit more comfort in our comfort. It's not the right word, but just like knowledge in the preparation, and that it's been planned by one person over a whole Olympic cycle that has previously had people in these boat classes on the podium. So it's like easy to believe in like, step on step two, step three. Yeah. And seeing like other people that are doing the same thing achieve success also, like help builds confidence. So yeah, I mean, I think it's gonna be really hard and it is really hard. Like this is a really hard thing to do and everyday is not easy. But I think there's just belief like, not just with us, but within the whole system that like we're all doing the right things and if everyone just comes and gives their best and is working really hard and yeah, we're all Little crazy in the head, but like you kind of have to be, the whole team is going to, like reap those benefits on the day that matters. That's

Sara Hendershot  1:00:09  
why you're going to perform well in Paris. Yeah. Like, but all. All of that is totally why you are going to perform well in Paris, is because you're coming in with this different level of maturity and experience. And like you are 100% going to be ready. Yeah, like, I can't even wait, guys, thank you. But I do think you're watching to buy the

Unknown Speaker  1:00:33  
music.

Kristi Wagner  1:00:34  
I do think it is like, not just us. Like, I do think it's like a systemic change, which I think is part of, you know, I 100% believe we're going to have a very fast women's aid at this Olympics. But I think in previous Olympics, it was like, the women's aid is the only thing that matters. And if other people do well, that's kind of like a cherry on top, you know, like who really like it's not that people wanted us to fail at all. But now it's like, just this belief, like belief and sort of investment in athletes and like different people's skill sets and all of that, which I think is really cool. Like, just as a collective. Yep, totally. Yeah. I love it. Yeah. Yeah. So no more words of wisdom. That was great. Yeah. Thank you so much. And thanks so much for listening. And thank you so much to Sarah for coming on and being so open and sharing so much. I really appreciated it. And I think it was a really interesting episode. And I hope that everyone learned a lot. And yeah, then we can cheer on the whole team this summer. So to leave you all this week and Miss sharing a quote from Wilma Rudolph, who said the potential for greatness lives within each of us. Thanks and have a great week. See you next time. I'd love to hear from you. So send us a topic suggestion or if you'd like to submit a question for our Ask Christy anything segment, head to our website, the other three years.com

Transcribed by https://otter.ai